Author Topic: Turbine wheel sizes  (Read 11304 times)

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SQPerformance

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Turbine wheel sizes
« on: November 01, 2012, 11:05:46 PM »
Ripped this off from a DSM site.

http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/turbo-system-tech/416410-turbine-sizes.html

From smallest to bigger.

Name Inducer Exducer Comments

TD05----55.8---- 47.5
TD05H-- 55.8 ---  49
HX30---  65.5---    52
TD06---  65 ----   55 Mhi 12 blade
TD06sl2--61---- 54 After market 11 blade
T31-----  65-----   56.6 AKA Stage III
HY35---- 65------  58 Also used in HE341CW, and
TD06H--- 67.31--- 58.8 Mhi 12 blade
TD06H----67.14----58.8  After market 11 blade
HX35----  70------ 60
GT30 ---- ?-------  60
GT35----  68------ 62.3
T352----   70----- 61.87 AKA StageV
P Trim---- 74----  64.5
HX40---   76----- 64? 67?
GT40 ---  77----- 68

After market sizes are from ebay ad's and may vary by vendor. (sqr)

SQPerformance

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Re: Turbine wheel sizes
« Reply #1 on: November 01, 2012, 11:07:53 PM »
Quote from: non-intercooled flatty
And the TD06SL2 turbine wheel, 61 mm inducer, 54 mm exducer.  I had a TD05 housing bored to fit the TD06SL2, need to get it installed in the flatty.

Good info.

Scott

EDIT!  Found this on ebay:  Turbine Shaft Wheel MHI TD07 Turbocharger 63 mm / 74.2 mm.

Quote from: funkyp
Quote from: non-intercooled flatty
And the TD06SL2 turbine wheel, 61 mm inducer, 54 mm exducer.  I had a TD05 housing bored to fit the TD06SL2, need to get it installed in the flatty.

Good info.

Scott

How much did that cost you? Im interested in having a dsm housing done up.

Quote from: non-intercooled flatty
I think about $150 but I'm sure you could get it done for less.  I had them bore the diameter out first thinking that would be enough but the blades on the SL2 are a hair taller before they taper so I had to go back and have them get the depth correct so it was an extra set up charge.

Quote from: TainterRacing
Who has run what turbines? I have used.

T31----- 65----- 56.6 AKA Stage III  Seems to have great power from about 2500-6200 Running a 38mm EX gate

T352---- 70----- 61.87 AKA StageV  Seem to have great power from about 3900+ Started to build boost about 3200rpms

I realized it matters a lot on the setup on how it worked but might be nice to help some others get an idea on what they might want to run and what one might expect from it.

SQPerformance

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Re: Turbine wheel sizes
« Reply #2 on: November 01, 2012, 11:09:50 PM »
Quote from: StarquestRescue
A local turbo shop  http://www.blouchturbo.com/ is machining one of my sq turbine housing to standard td06 spec's for $75.

I have ran a 18g in 05, 05h and 05h 15* clip.

Quote from: funkyp

Awesome! Too bad you didnt have them machine a DSM housing instead. Cant wait to see the results.

Quote from: StarquestRescue
An mhi 06 turbine is $238, ouch.  :cry:

SQPerformance

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Re: Turbine wheel sizes
« Reply #3 on: November 01, 2012, 11:10:46 PM »
Quote from: StarquestRescue
06 besides a 05





SQPerformance

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Re: Turbine wheel sizes
« Reply #4 on: November 01, 2012, 11:12:17 PM »
Quote from: funkyp
DAMN!! That really puts that shitty flow into perspective..... Does the Gasket match it?
Where did you get the turbine wheel from? Find it for cheap?

Quote from: StarquestRescue
The gasket bore is barely big enough.

I have been looking for a used 06 20g or 06 turbine and they are just not out there to be had.

My options are the aftermarket Kinugawa turbo 06 turbine for $139 shipped or the a mhi turbine at $239 plus shipping or gas to pick it up. I was going to spring for the mhi when i picked up the housing, but felt i was to poor that day.

When i mentioned the sl2 to the shop they said they do not have the program to machine the housing for it, and it flowed and was balanced poorly. That sounded like bull shit, but i was not in the mood to debate it. The shop uses proprietary 11 blade turbines and billet "20g"compressor wheels in there Subaru upgrades. When i asked them about a billet compressor several years ago the said it would not fit. wtf. Perhaps they are made with a larger shaft?

I ran a Kinugawa 05h turbine for about 2000 miles and it was ok, as well as a big improvement over the 05. I have since found a source for mhi 05h turbines at half the cost of the Kinugawa's

Quote from: funkyp
I cant say ive seen many turbine related failures in the china turbo's. But then your supporting commies lol

Can a T31 wheel be made to fit?
Its too bad, im sure this turbo will rock. But at the end of the day, an hy/hx35 can be had for around $300

SQPerformance

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Re: Turbine wheel sizes
« Reply #5 on: November 01, 2012, 11:13:03 PM »
Quote from: StarquestRescue
05h 15* clip.



Standard 06



The 06 is about 268 grams
The 05h about 202
The 05 about 198
The 05h 15* clipped about 192

SQPerformance

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Re: Turbine wheel sizes
« Reply #6 on: November 01, 2012, 11:14:39 PM »
Quote from: StarquestRescue
I probably should have went with the 06h or 06 sl2. The 06h is about  .140-.150. bigger.That would leave a wall thickness of about .187 depending on core shift or not. Probably a little thin. Probably not an option.

Originally i was leaning toward the Taiwan made 11 blade sl2. The published specs on that is about .052 smaller exducer which would make it a little sloppy in a 06 housing.

My 06 housing has about ..040 (.020 each side) clearance between the boar and turbine.

The mhi 06 turbin ended up costing $196

Non ic flatty, what  diameter did you have your sl2 housing boared to?

Quote from: StarquestRescue
Butt dyno says more power at lower boost and it pulls hard up top, and the data logges support that.  But turbine back pressure is still high, maybe a little less then the clipped 05. A fairer comparison would probably be back pressure at x amount of hp vs at x amount of boost.

The clipped 05h needed lots of help to keep the wastegate closed enough to make the big boost.

With the 06 i ended up setting the waste gate as loose as possible to get the initial spike down to about 19-20 psi. Than it dips a little and rises to about 18.5 and hold flat boost tell i lift at about 5300.

At this point i would prefer to do the high boost higher rpm dial in at the track.

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Re: Turbine wheel sizes
« Reply #7 on: November 01, 2012, 11:17:52 PM »
Quote from: funkyp
BAM



18g td05h/Race Gas - 297whp 403wtq @ 25psi


18g td05h 15* clip/E85 - 307whp 360wtq @ 25psi


18g td06/ E85/KDM FMIC and pipes - 358whp 393wtq @ 25psi

SQPerformance

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Re: Turbine wheel sizes
« Reply #8 on: November 01, 2012, 11:20:57 PM »
Quote from: non-intercooled flatty
Quote
Non ic flatty, what diameter did you have your sl2 housing boared to?

I've looked everywhere and can't find that record but I can give you the process:  I just measured the stock turbine wheel in several places to get an average, did the same with the stock turbine bore and computed the clearance.  Then I just had the turbine bore machined for the same clearance with the SL2.  I do have the specs on the depth bore, its the same diameter as stock around the snail but the depth of that diameter is 1.130" from the turbine/CHRA mounting flange.  The SL2 wheel fins are just a fraction taller before they taper than the stock 05 wheel.

I've finally got the new turbo and exhaust manifold installed and some run time on it.  This is a stock rebuilt CHRA and 12A compressor, non-intercooled, and a stock exhaust manifold with no porting.  The exhaust manifold and turbine are coated internally and externally for a thermal barrier to keep heat in the exhaust stream (along with the stock gutted downpipe), the compressor is externally coated for thermal dispersion and the CHRA bearings and shaft got the thin film lubricant coating.  Everything else is stock including the rest of the exhaust (with factory cat), ECU, intake and injectors.  I can say the SL2 is what the factory should have put on from the beginning.  Boost threshold is still less than 2000 rpm, full boost (all of 5 psi?) a little after that and it just keeps pulling up to 6K.  Drives like stock with way more potential.  I'm betting better mpg too!  I'll be looking for a 7.5 psi wastegate spring  now.

Quote from: funkyp
OH MY LORD thats awesome, you put it behind a 12a. Youve somehow peeked into my box of want to's........ Just awesome!  :)

 I have a wastegate you can have if you would like. Also a 3 port.

Quote from: non-intercooled flatty
Yeah, I'm tempted to drive the flatty to Little Rock just to see where the torque curve starts to sag and how much power there is over stock rating.

I was thinking about the torque curve and cams, everyone is always asking about a cam but most cams don't provide any benefit when the turbine is choking top end.  After all, why would you want to make a cam change unless you wanted more top end?  So, if I bypassed the turbo, going directly from the air can to the throttle body, then made a dyno run I'd get a torque curve and peak at XXX rpm's.  Not a true N/A torque peak because the exhaust is choked a bit from the turbine but a torque curve that better simulates what you get from the stock cam/naturally aspirated.  Then I connect the turbo and get a boosted torque curve and compare it to the simulated N/A curve.  If my rpm at peak torque was LOWER for the run with the turbo than without I'd say that my turbine is too small, correct?  No need to consider a cam change, my VE is dominated (limited) by the small turbine.  Now, if my rpm at peak torque for the turbo run was THE SAME OR HIGHER than the simulated N/A run then I'd say I need a cam change because my VE is becoming limited by the stock cam.

Of course I'm talking about rpm at peak torque, not the magnitude of the torque peak because that will (hopefully) always be bigger in the turbo case.  Does this make sense?  It would be easy to do, plus I could bring along a hotter cam to swap in if necessary.

Quote from: funkyp
What if we built a pipe to connect to the ex manifold? leave the chra in place for obvious reasons and remove the turbine housing. then bolt a pipe to the manifold?

What about a dynograph from a D50? If all you want is to see where the curve lives. Same cam/head. That should give it.

Also, wouldnt just running a stock td05 then your new turbine back to back be enough proof?

But yes, very few offered cam grinds are worth a shit due to lack of R&D and documentation. Due you have an adjustable gear? Otherwise, the cam swap results would be inaccurate unless they shared the same ICL.

Sqr

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Re: Turbine wheel sizes
« Reply #9 on: November 24, 2012, 07:56:09 PM »
Measuring a 05 turbine.

TD05----55.8---- 47.5 or 1.870
TD05H-- 55.8 ---  49 or 1.929

The smaller part of the wheel is what you want to measure


Sqr

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Re: Turbine wheel sizes
« Reply #10 on: December 26, 2012, 06:19:04 PM »
New Mitsu 9 blade turbine besides a td05h, said to be 500 hp capable.



Some dimensions some one posted on dsm fourms.

-----Compressor--------Turbine

green = 53/73 + 57/65 (11 blade)

red = 55/76 + 59/67 (11 blade)

new mitsu hotness = 55/76 + 54/61.5 (9 blade)

ef2 =52/69 + 54/61 (11 blade)